Ep. 94: Alpaca wool, traceability and North Stars

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Ep. 94: Alpaca wool, traceability and North Stars

The Textile Innovation Podcast speaks with Kris Cody, founder and chief executive officer at PAKA – a company on a mission to create natural, traceable and all-purpose clothing from alpaca fibres.

WTiN
Hello and welcome to textile innovation hosted by WTiN. My name is Ruby and I'm the news editor and your podcast host. Each month we're going to be joined by a brand new special guest. So join me and my colleagues as we deep dive into what's new, what's interesting and what unmissable innovations have hit the market recently, we cover everything on the podcast from sustainability to startups and the latest research and developments. And we also quiz the experts in the fields about their new products and ideas across a huge spectrum that is the textiles industry. So no matter what your interest is WTiN and have you covered and we can connect you to everything you need to know right here from our central hub in the UK. In this episode, we speak to Chris Cody, founder and CEO at packer, which is based between the US and Peru. Pica says its mission is to create natural or purpose clothing from alpaca fibres. One of its core principles according to Chris is incorporating traceability within that the organisation has grown exponentially after a Kickstarter that it launched in 2021 exceeded its goal by over 1,700% Chris and I talk about certification, the history and the goals going forward.

Kris Cody
Hey, Ruby, how you doing? Thank you so much for chatting with me. I'm very excited to get into this with you. Let's dive right into this. Firstly, can you tell me about the history of the company, its missions and its outputs about yourself as well as perhaps most importantly, why are packers I've started pakka actually on a backpacking trip when I came across this alpaca sweater in Peru. I was just travelling through South America and hadn't got the sweater from this grandmother artisan that had made it and I never touched anything as soft and lightweight as that material. And so I was just blown away by that. And when I got back to the US, every time I would wear it people would ask where it came from majority of the world. I mean, they know Merino pretty well and cashmere but there was little awareness around alpaca and out was just fell in love with Peru and the culture there and in this material. And so I flew back on a one way flight and started living alongside a team of proving Quechua Weaver's on the top of their house. And they became like family to me. And we started working on some prototypes with the vision to bring all pakka to the world with an amazing, functional story behind it. And that's what we've been working on ever since since 2017. So did you have any prior history with textiles? And is this all brand new to you? No, I was studying neuroscience actually, at the time and launched a Kickstarter for that original alpaca sweater out of my dorm room, took off and raised Behringer 50k in 30 days, Oh, wow. At that time, I actually dropped out for a semester to fly down and work with Albert Gatos, out there in the Andes Mountains and scale the vertical supply chain and and so that was my first experience into into textiles. But I think the science foundational like obsession with this fibre really is where it came from of showcasing how incredible functionally it is in the hollow air pockets it has and how it can regulate temperature better than than any other natural fibre. It's three times lighter than sheep's wool. It's soft as cashmere, the only thing warmer than a pack is polar bear fur. And so there are some amazing qualities that through science I've found in in working and focusing on that functional aspect. That's really what we're trying to do is bring that to the modern world. Amazing. And I know that traceability is also a big aspect of the company. Do you want to go into that a little bit how it's done with you guys? And why is it so important for traceability to be an aspect for you? Since this company started, we've been working to bring people closer to where the things come from, we've become so detached from, I mean, whether it's our food or clothing in understanding the source of that, and for us, whether it's the woman's signature on the sweater, who made it or the traceable tag that now comes in all of our clothing, what we want people to know is where the things came from, who made them what they're made of just with full transparency, that traceable aspect has been here since the get go. And so Gisela our head of Peru is really the hero who built out the full traceability in our supply chain starting at where the fibre is sourced and being able to trace that all the way through the supply chain until it lands on the customer's doorstep. And so that comes with a QR code and you can scan it and see literally the coordinates in the Andes Mountains where our clothing came from. And I think like for us, we really just want people to have that transparency and education for them to make the decisions and and it's being done as I'm sure you're aware in so many different industries now, but for us it didn't exist with ELPAC. And so we literally had to build this ourselves.

From the ground up to create that, like what we saw happen with food, where people really started caring about the source of of their food was done because of a health, oh, that I'm going to consume this and it's going to directly impact my health. So I want to make sure it's organic. I want to make sure it's good for me. Right. And I think the clothing industry have slightly lagged behind in general, because people haven't understood that direct health impact on them, versus like saying how this impacts, you know, a fish in the ocean consuming microplastics because of that downstream impact. And so, what's really amazing is, you know, the microplastics in 80% of Americans, right, and how this is literally impacting our health for consumers to really take decisions to wear natural fibres. And so I think that traceability is one step to it, but there's a lot more work to be done. Definitely. And on the topic actually, of microplastics another win for natural fibres. I read the other day that they've started finding microplastics in clouds. What's amazing to me, is how fast we've masked commercialised plastic. I mean, after World War Two is when it really was mass commercialised and the fact that in less than a century, we're finding it and 80% like, like what you're seeing in clouds in the corners of the globe. Like in the Arctic, we work with this amazing environmentalist Cristina Mittermeier, who travels around the oceans with a huge goal to preserve 30% of our ocean, by 2030, and microplastics are being found everywhere. To me, it's just amazing the impact that humans can have in such a short time in just the tangibility like, and I think that's proof that well, on the flip side, we also have the complete control to change that narrative. And that's what's inspiring to me.

WTiN
Definitely, and this leads me on quite nicely to our next question. Sustainability seems to be definitely at the core of what you're doing, can you share some of the key initiatives and practices that you that you follow, really, and what sets you apart from other companies working with natural fibres? I think for any company, or at least for packet to have impact, we need to make the best product. And so with sustainability and working with natural fibres, we've really distilled down to, well, this needs to perform better than what's on the market, right and needs to perform better than plastics and sit just like as a product sitting next to any other the function needs to be there. And so our overall goal is for people to wear nature, get more nature, on their bodies and in to do so you know, the garment can't fall apart, the garment needs extreme integrity and stability and function. And so with that, we're driving a huge r&d pipeline, working with some of the best global experts around the world, like this, you know, patent pending pack installation that we've created that tests warmer than any synthetic insulation, things like that are a really important, because otherwise sustainability can become a guilt trip. And I think that can turn consumers off to some extent. And so for us, it's to make the best product from nature. So WTiN, we use a commercial readiness scale that consists of three things, which is emerging scaling, and then commercially ready to distinguish stages of development. Where would you say that you fall on that scale? And maybe where would you like to be on that scale? Long term? Like, what's the end goal for the company? What's the vision,

Kris Cody
We fall on all three of those in terms of our r&d pipeline, right, and so for instance, our this new ELPAC installation that we've been producing and manufacturing now and talking to other companies to use in their jackets that's commercially ready and whatnot. Whereas say that this new alpaca polar fleece that we've developed, we're releasing in December, that's more in like the emerging category. And so we have a full r&d pipeline and sit differently for different products and parts of the brand. But our long term goal here is to bring it back to the outdoor industry, and work alongside the best experts to do so. And scale that and we also understand, you know, one company is not going to change the whole industry. And we need hundreds of critters working to the same Northstar to do so. And so my long term vision is really to enable that beyond alpaca. It would be a dream to help enable a sustainable incubator for creators working with nature and these amazing innovations that I've seen and other founders that I speak to, to help bring those to market as well. And so pack is a vessel right now for alpaca getting to the outdoor industry and in mainstream and that's commercially ready and scaling right now.

WTiN
I'm amazing. And I'd also like to talk about certification because I feel like that's something that does kind of go hand in hand with anything to do with sustainability, because you can say that you're doing these things. But you've got to prove it, which is what you've done. So your B Corp certified, which is amazing. Could you share what that entails for you? How easy was that process? And are there any other certifications that you've either got or are working towards? I'm sure you see a lot of greenwashing to your point, like just in the research that you do as a journalist and, unfortunately, so yes, for sure. Definitely hold companies to to their word in some extent. And so for us being one of the highest raking B corpse, that process was very rigorous in to be honest, I'm actually very impressed with the B Corp team in the depth that they go and screening companies and the qualification process. And so that was a great certification. And we're super proud to be on that list of other amazing companies changing the industry towards a more sustainable future. We, I mean, just in terms of product, we have a lot of certifications, Ecotec certifications, bluesign certifications, and then our new outerwear that we're just releasing right now as we speak on our site. And it's taking off just one ISPO award this week, which is one of the most prestigious global awards in the outdoor industry. And so we'll be flying out to Munich, the end of this month to attend that ISPO event. And so, just being around other creators that are also innovating and making awesome products is exciting. But to answer your question directly about certifications, the B Corp definitely holds the weight there for us. And then we can back that up with tonnes of certifications and then our own like the traceable alpaca certification is something that we've literally created because it didn't exist. And for that, then it brings down okay, well, we know where these come from. And we can also backup responsible alpaca cert certification. Right, Raz, which you may be familiar with, like, responsible wool, in so specifically to alpaca. We had to build that traceable certification because it didn't exist. I'd like to now draw upon your knowledge, as we all know, fast fashion is dominating the market at the moment with all that you've seen and your experience and your your knowledge now, how how do you see that the textiles industry evolving into a more sustainable stance in the future, maybe not in the next few years, but maybe in 10 years, maybe further than that? Well, as we know, I mean, consumers are the ones that call the shots, right and make the decisions and enable a lot of that change, it has to come from them. And as long as the demand is there for those really fast fashion consumerism, what needs to be done as consumers to be educated about the impact of their decisions. And also just for textiles, specifically, what wearing plastics versus wearing nature does for them, I think with the research and awareness, we can change that. And I think like that's how it needs to evolve is I'm very consumer first, right? Like the consumer helps with us dictate the best product, what they want, what they're looking for, and we build for them. I think the industry needs to have that mindset of building for them and in what we know, with our experience and knowledge for the ultimate planetary health and human health. And so like, with those goals that we have aligned on right, United Nations or whatnot, like, it's very important that we learn forces to tell that narrative. Have you seen a shift in that already? I don't know if you have a hope you have. But I have myself as a consumer. Maybe in the last like, I know, three or four years or so there's definitely been more of a shift where people are actively seeking out things that are better and seeking out companies that are doing better as well. Have you seen that? Definitely. I mean, even just the questions that customers are asking us is awesome, you know, that people are really digging into that and want to understand more, that wareness has grown. And we see that across all channels. And we're excited to continue. That's where the transparency comes. It's like you can really look at this and come down to Peruvian and see it our consumers sometimes like some people have hit us up to go down to Peru, and go to that alpaca farm where it came from. Just that full transparency is awesome. And I think people really enjoy connection, as it's just like, human biologically, that's what we crave. And so to be able to provide that is really important. On the opposing side of what we've just talked about. Going back to Packer now, could you tell me about some of the challenges that the company has faced and how you've overcome them? Well, to start, we've been bootstrapped. So we haven't we didn't receive any financing or investment up until this point. And that has had to really for us, the growth has been limited to the growth of that customer and one of the greatest challenges we've had

Kris Cody
Just as a bootstrap company, the financing and whatnot, but we've tripled year after year. And that's been amazing because of the demand for what we're building. And so it's obviously a blessing. But it's definitely been the greatest challenge I've ever faced. Just being new to building a brand and what that takes, operationally, financially. And in that back end, in terms of another challenge, I think the current machinery and technology for alpaca in Peru has been gotten us to a certain point where we are, but there's been challenges we've really had to overcome and making this, like we said earlier, the most functional product. And so we've had to drive innovation in Taiwan, in the US with like SpaceX labs to create that, you know, installation, or with some of the best heads of r&d from Primaloft and polar tech for this new fleece. And we've just had to lean on expertise and look outside of our current box to be able to understand what's possible with alpaca fibre and really drive that because it doesn't exist. And so for us, it's like, the challenge is the sky's the limit, but there's no template or scaffold to easily just scale. We're building that right now. And obviously, the Merino industry has done incredible things for us to lean on and learn from the r&d challenge. There has been my favourite part. It's an exciting challenge, hopefully, with anything that people do. The challenge is the love. That's what gets you out of bed in the morning. Definitely challenge. Something I like to end each podcast with is kind of a little bit off topic, but it is for good reason. So I've interviewed people from the US. I've interviewed people in over in the UK to the parts of Europe, Australia, and Hong Kong, and they all have kind of different answers, depending on what area they're from, like geographically and within the industry, too. I'm looking forward to hearing your answer on this one, the United Nations Sustainable Development Goals, do you think they are achievable by 2030? Yes or no, I'd love to hear why I believe humans can achieve anything when we land on a Northstar. We touched on a little earlier. And we need to hold hands as one species and say this is important. And so I think they're absolutely achievable if we're able to hold hands and say, Yes, we agree this is important, whether from a corporate level imposing that or just as an awareness level. I think, for them to not go under the radar is the biggest challenge here for people to really drive that change. And so my answer is absolutely, yes. If we align that that is our North Star. And so I think awareness is the biggest challenge and alignment. And if we're able to do that we've clearly proved anything as possible as as a species. What a wonderful answer and a wonderful place to enter the question. Thank you so much for that. Finally, for anyone listening, who does want to get in touch with you, and kind of work with you guys, what is the best way to do that? Or website is packard.co just p aka.co. Obviously, reach out to our customer service team and write me personally as well. It's just my name is just Chris Kerr is APAC apparel.com. And in our Instagram, all of our socials, were very active and love to talk.

WTiN
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